Voices of Esalen Podcast

Ramzi Fawaz is an award-winning queer cultural critic, public speaker, and educator. He is the author of two books, including The New Mutants: Superheroes and the Radical Imagination of American Comics (2016), and Queer Forms (2022). In 2019-2020, Fawaz was a Stanford Humanities Center fellow. He is currently a Romnes Professor of English at the University of Wisconsin, Madison.

Please be warned: this conversation is a firehose of brilliance. We cover a frankly outrageous number of topics, including: The politics and poetics of gender/ The radical imagination of the 1960s and 70s/ What happens when college students of today read manifestos from the 1970s and discover just how fiery, and fearless those voices actually were/ How feminist and gay liberation were deeply intertwined... and yet different/ The dark seduction of wounded identity and the political dead-end of suffering as a personality/ What the Beatles, postwar masculinity, and femme androgyny have to do with trans desire and cultural anxiety/ How trans liberation actually predates gay liberation in the U.S. / Teaching as ego dissolution: what it means to use the classroom like a psychedelic space. / And the idea that pluralism — true, radical pluralism — begins by accepting that you will be changed by contact with people who are radically different from you.

Ramzi Fawaz is bold, funny, passionate about teaching, absurdly articulate, and I think you’ll find he is deeply attuned to the moment we’re living in.

A quick note on AI: I use LLMs (often the multi-purposse ChatGPT, sometimes other models) to help me with various tasks associated with podcast production, including help with writing my intros, generating questions for my guests, and episode titles. Occasionally I create episode graphics, too. I almost never take the AI output as-is; I subscribe to Ethan Mollick's notion of co-intelligence, in that I edit what's been given me, add my own creativity, and aim for the best possible output in the end. My hope is that this will create a better Voices of Esalen. - SS

Today, we're opening the vaults to share a rare and remarkable recording from Esalen’s rich historical archive: a 1967 lecture and live demonstration by none other than Dr. Ida Rolf, the pioneering founder of Structural Integration—more commonly known today as Rolfing.

But what is Rolfing? Often described as intense (and sometimes even painful), Rolfing is a powerful form of bodywork that focuses on the manipulation and realignment of connective tissue—fascia—to promote structural balance and physical freedom. Ida Rolf believed that by methodically reorganizing the body’s structure in gravity, not only could chronic pain and postural issues be resolved, but profound emotional and psychological healing could also occur.

This archival gem features Dr. Rolf in her element—lecturing with intellectual precision, delivering her insights with wit and candor, and guiding a live demo with such vivid specificity that, even without visuals, you feel transported into the room beside her. It’s a masterclass in both bodywork and presence.

A little backstory: Ida Rolf first came to Esalen in the 1960s at the invitation of famed Gestalt therapist Fritz Perls, who would become one of her earliest champions. According to The Upstart Spring, Rolf worked on Perls daily for a week. On the seventh day, during a neck session, he passed out—briefly. When he came to, he recounted a deeply buried trauma: a therapist twisting his neck under anesthesia decades earlier. The memory, and its accompanying tension, had haunted him for years. He credited Rolf’s work with helping to release it.

After that, Perls became an ardent supporter of Rolfing, and Ida returned to Esalen again and again. Esalen Institute would become the West Coast hub for her method, just as it had for Gestalt therapy.

This episode is a rare opportunity to hear Dr. Rolf in her own voice, offering not just a window into the origins of Rolfing, but a taste of the charisma, intellect, and force of will that helped her change the way we think about the body, healing, and human potential.

Once again, we’re diving deep into the Esalen archives to share a fascinating historical recording - this one featuring electronic music pioneer Doug McKechnie.

In the late 1960s and early '70s, Doug McKechnie was at the cutting edge of musical innovation, harnessing the revolutionary Moog synthesizer to create mesmerizing sounds. McKechnie was a contemporary of iconic figures like Wendy Carlos, known for the 1968 record "Switched-on Bach," a collection of pieces by Bach that were performed by Carlos on the Moog synthesizer. This album, which won a Grammy for Classical Album of the Year, played a key role in bringing synthesizers to popular music. McKechnie was also tied to the Grateful Dead, contributing to the band's most experimental album, "Aoxomoxoa.” He also played at Altamont, not really a feather in anyone’s cap, but it shows the breadth of his growing popularity, and that of the Moog synthesizer.

Moogs are characterized by distinctive electronic timbres and pulsating rhythms, as well as hypnotic sequences. They are very much a part of the psychedelia of the late 1960s, fitting right in with the oil light shows, pop art, face paint and neon day glo colors of the time. The Moog’s ability to generate evocative psycho-acoustic atmospheres allowed musicians like McKechnie to tap into the exploration of internal landscapes that seemed to naturally occur during psychedelic adventures.

The performance you’re about to hear was recorded live at Esalen in the late 1960s, preserved for decades on half inch to reel, then dusted off, digitized, and transported to you via the magic of podcasting.

So sit back, relax, and let the Moog take you on a trippy auditory journey to a pivotal moment in musical and technological history.

Richard Horan first arrived at Esalen in the mid 1960s, traveling from Los Angeles to Big Sur at the height of a cultural renaissance. He was an early member of the Esalen massage crew and played a pivotal role in founding the Esalen Garden, a space that continues to nourish the land and community today. He was also deeply involved in the psychedelic inquiry of the time.

Over the years, his connections to Esalen deepened: with Gabrielle Roth he had a son, Jonathan Horan. Later, he married Peggy Horan, and together they raised two daughters, Lucia and Jasmine.

Horan's purpose as an artist was revealed to him during his time at Esalen when he founded the Art Barn as a collective with other artists.

Horan remains legendary in Big Sur for his mastery of jade carving. His work includes rings, earrings, pendants, belt buckles, and sculptures, many of which are inspired by ancient esoteric symbols and indigenous traditions. His signature earrings are renowned for their thin-cut jade, which allows light to pass through.

As a multi media artist, he has worked in depth with clay, redwood and jade, making musical instruments, art objects and jewelry.

Today, we’ll hear from Richard as he reflects on his journey—his artistic process, his connection to Esalen, and the life he has built in harmony with the wild nature of Big Sur.

See Richard's work on his website, Big Sur Jade Jewelry.

A few months ago we brought you a real Esalen check-in (episode one). This practice, rooted in the Gestalt therapy that evolved at Esalen over the years, is an authentic cornerstone of the Esalen experience. It's often described as a catalyst for self-awareness, connection, and personal growth.

Today's episode is a continuation: Episode 2.

Our check-in features Alex Shepherd, Peggy Horan, Jess Siller, Faith Blakeney, Shira Levine, and Sam Stern.

What you'll hear is real. It is authentic and unscripted. While our participants were aware of being recorded, they spoke from the heart. We've made every effort to preserve the intimacy and rawness of the experience with only minimal editing.

This is the secret sauce — the open, honest sharing that forms the foundation for personal transformation.

Today we're opening up the vault to share an extraordinary archival recording from one of the most influential figures in Esalen's history, Frederic Spiegelberg — and while that name might not be as immediately recognizable as some of the luminaries who graced Esalen's grounds, like Joseph Campbell, Alan Watts, or Gabrielle Roth, understanding Frederic Spiegelberg and his place in Esalen mythology might be key to understanding Esalen itself . . . because in truth, without Frederic Spiegelberg, there might well never have been an Esalen at all.

In 1950, Esalen co-founder Michael Murphy was just another Stanford student when he, by complete accident, attended one of Friedric Spiegelberg's philosophy courses. As recounted in Jeffrey Kripal's fantastic book, Esalen: America and the Religion of No Religion, that single class would become an initiatory event that transformed Murphy's life forever, providing a pivotal bridge into the metaphysical, the mystical, and the psychical realms, dimensions that would go on to define the course of his life.

The recording you're about to hear takes place in 1968, nearly two decades after Michael Murphy’s satori. Frederic Spiegelberg, as you'll hear, is still a force to be reckoned with. He speaks of the convergence between Eastern and Western thought, the transformative power of spiritual experience, and the boundless capacity for human growth.

And as you listen to this beautiful recording, originally made on half-inch reel to reel tape that we've recently uncovered in the Esalen vault, dusted off, digitized, and are in the process of joyfully rediscovering, maybe consider this: that you're not just hearing a lecture from the past. Instead, you're taking part in a transmission. A thread that connects the early days of Esalen to the present moment. You're stepping into the very space where minds were opened and spirits awakened and the seeds of some sort of transformation were sown.

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For the past several years, I’ve been lucky enough to work closely with the famed and slightly disorganized Esalen archives, diving deep into the history of this extraordinary place. I’ve fashioned several multimedia talks out of the material that I’ve uncovered, one on the history of altered states at Esalen, another on the 1970s and 80s. And recently, I had one of those rare, thrilling moments that every archive enthusiast — every crate digger, like me — dreams of.

A while back, I made a trip out to a storage facility near the Monterey Airport, with the producer of this podcast, Shira Levine, and we found boxes upon boxes of historical materials—photographs, slides, notes, VHS tapes, catalogs. As I sifted through them, I stumbled upon something incredible: a box filled with 5” reel-to-reel tapes, very likely recorded in the 1960s and ’70s by a man named Paul Herbert.

This was the kind of find that makes you stop in your tracks. Material that had been thought lost — or at the very least, forgotten — suddenly resurfaced in my hands. As I carefully unraveled the reels, I realized I was holding audio time capsules, voices and ideas from Esalen’s past waiting to be rediscovered.

Today, I’m sharing one of those recordings. This reel was titled Music from the Big Sur Mountains, and to be completely honest, even after having listened to it, I’m not sure exactly what year it comes from. Based on what I know, I’d place it somewhere between the mid-1960s and mid-1970s.

And it is exactly what it sounds like: music from the mountains of Big Sur. You’ll hear musicians local to the area playing hand drums, outside, in the mystic air. But it’s more than just drumming. This recording is alive with the sounds of Esalen itself — the rhythm of hands on drums, the voices of vocalists, the barks of dogs, the laughter and shouts of children, who are more than likely in their 50s and 60s now. It’s a time capsule, a window into a world that no longer exists in quite the same way.

Podcast description by Sam Stern and ChatGPT.

Listen to Sam's recent talk at the Berkeley Alembic on The History of Esalen in the 1970s and 80s.

Shannon Algeo is a psychotherapist, author, and teacher. He is also a Soul Coach, Yoga Nidra teacher, and the founder of Soulumination Meditation. Shannon works with clients to heal patterns of trauma so they can show up in the world with presence, purpose, and peace. His work has been featured in Rolling Stone, ABC news, and Yoga Journal.

Shannon came to Esalen in December of 2024 to lead a workshop on smartphone addiction. Together we spoke about attachment theory and how it figures into technology addiction, what it feels like to be in Big Sur, detached from your phone, and the digital personas we create and how we attempt to live up to them.

Deborah Eden Tull is a leading Buddhist and EcoDharma teacher whose wisdom has touched countless lives. Recently, Eden and her husband, Mark, faced a life-altering tragedy when Hurricane Helene swept through Western North Carolina, destroying their home as well as all their belongings, and very nearly claiming their lives.

Eden has long been a powerful voice urging humanity to face the climate crisis with clarity and courage, and her teachings feel especially poignant in light of this personal loss. In this conversation, we explore her reflections on resilience, interconnection, and how we can meet these challenging times with open hearts.

View Eden's gripping 10-minute video that captures the aftermath of Hurricane Helene on Instagram or YouTube.

Please consider donating to Eden and Mark's GoFundMe. You can also visit their GoFund Me by simply searching for "GoFund Me Deborah Eden Tull."

Find out more about Mark’s Stress Relief Flower Essence blend.

Dr. Victor Santiago Pineda is a globally recognized scholar, disability rights advocate, social impact entrepreneur, and international consultant on accessibility and inclusion. Born in Caracas, Venezuela, Dr. Pineda was diagnosed with a form of muscular dystrophy as a child, a challenge that inspired his lifelong commitment to advancing the rights and dignity of people with disabilities. He became the youngest delegate involved in drafting the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities, a groundbreaking treaty that has impacted millions around the world.

Dr. Pineda holds degrees in political economy, business administration, city and regional planning, and a PhD in urban planning from UCLA, where his research on disability rights and urban development garnered international acclaim. As the founder of the Pineda Foundation and World Enabled, he has spearheaded initiatives that have brought global attention to the inclusion of disabled youth in education, employment, and policy-making. His innovative projects, such as "It's Our Story," an oral history project documenting the lived experiences of people with disabilities, and "It's About Ability," an educational program for children, have been translated into multiple languages and received international awards.

Beyond his scholarly and advocacy work, Dr. Pineda is also a filmmaker, author, and thought leader whose work spans the fields of urban planning, human rights, and social innovation. He has advised organizations like UNICEF, UNESCO, the World Bank, and national governments on creating inclusive policies and practices. Dr. Pineda’s visionary leadership continues to redefine how societies view accessibility, equality, and the potential of all individuals, regardless of their abilities. On this episode of Voices of Esalen, we delve into his remarkable journey, groundbreaking initiatives, and powerful vision for a more inclusive world.

Watch the trailer for Dr. Pineda's documentary UNCONFINED: Towards a life without limits.